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Old 12-15-2012   #11
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Default Re: Mental Illness Control (Gun Related)

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If steps are taken to identify the mentally ill that may be prone to harming themselves or others and placing them in an appropriate controlled environment, neither event would have taken place. Have the discussion, is it the guns or the people. If it is the people do something about the people. We know it is not the guns.
I believe a certain forward thinker in history had a similar notion, his name was Adolf something or other, Hitler I think.
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Old 12-15-2012   #12
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I thought it was already illegal for people with mental illness to purchase firearms.
No, it is unlawful for people who have been adjudicated mentally ill to purchase firearms. All of the other insane people may buy as many as they can afford.
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Old 12-15-2012   #13
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No, it is unlawful for people who have been adjudicated mentally ill to purchase firearms. All of the other insane people may buy as many as they can afford.
Mental illness does not automatically mean insane. For instance, your general application of the term mental illness would basically mean someone with an eating disorder could not purchase a gun.

See the slippery slope? It's right there in front of you...
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Old 12-15-2012   #14
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As of now...in most states...if all current pertinent info is on record...you will not pass a NICS check to purchase a firearm from an FFL, if...

You are a convicted felon.
You have a restraining order against you.
You have been ordered by a judge to seek treatment for a mental illness. (Which, I guess, gives you a pass to your first offense, at whichever age, and whichever offense...there's the rub...in this CT case!) I'm for the repeal of HIPA. There are those who need care for their mental illness, but doctors have to share their information! Without information, courts cannot act, accordingly. The movie, "Minority Report", is a film that depicts the detainment of citizens suspected of crimes before they happen. Wishful thinking...for some people...but the American Experiment...some will disagree...is still alive!

But thats only to own a firearm.

To carry a concealed weapon on your person...NH (local)

Fill out a form to include signatures from 3 of your neighbors.
Tell why you're applying for a license, home defense, jewelry courier, etc.
Pay a fee. (Which varies greatly from state to state.) $10 in NH. $100 in MA.
The local police chief in your town is the one who signs the permit. Some
police chiefs are reticent, believing that CCW permits aggravate gun crime.
Other chiefs believe that issuing CCW permits prevent burgularies, mass murders,
and the ability to defend one's life/family while officials take the time respond,
when they are able.
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Old 12-16-2012   #15
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Default Re: Mental Illness Control (Gun Related)

I think its more of a common sense issue than one of gun control the mother knew her son was unstable from the reports I am seeing and should have locked her weapons up in a safe.
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Old 12-16-2012   #16
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I think its more of a common sense issue than one of gun control the mother knew her son was unstable from the reports I am seeing and should have locked her weapons up in a safe.
Big slippery slope. How would it be determined at what level the person is dangerous? And people would say, if someone is breaking into their house, am I suppose to say 'Hold on a second until I open my safe, get my gun and load it, please.'.

As pointed out, the guns were legally owned by the mother and she was killed as well. So he was getting them one way or another.
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Old 12-16-2012   #17
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Default Re: Mental Illness Control (Gun Related)

you have to deal with the most viable threat at the time so they should have been locked away from the son. The mother should have been the only one with a combination. I had to do the same thing with guns knives and any deadly object while a family member was going through a tough time and wasn't stable. you don't ignore a existing threat for the possibility of one.
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Old 12-16-2012   #18
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Default Re: Mental Illness Control (Gun Related)

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If it is the people do something about the people. We know it is not the guns.
It's not even the people, per se, its the culture. We have, as a society, a particular world view that believes violence against another is a way to remove a problem, or to obtain something. The history of America (and other countries as well) is dominated by the use of force and violence to get things, or remove things. The history of mankind is, for the most part, a study in violence. The government does it, books exemplify it, movies show it. Movies are far more likely to show explicit violence than graphic sex. It's a lot like the the drug culture. How can we say on one hand don't use drugs when there is so much advertising, promotion and acceptance to take drugs for any number of reasons....from headaches to ED ....

Part of this world view, this culture of ours, is the corporate money element. In the case of guns, its the gun manufacturers; in the case of drugs, its the pharmaceutical companies. In the case of energy, its the oil companies. In the case of food, its the agribusiness.

It's this culture of violence (of which greed, and fear, is a component), whether with a gun in a school, a fist in a home, a bully on the playground or harsh abusive words from a parent to a child that needs to be addressed.

Isaac Asimov, the science fiction writer, is noted to have said "violence is the last refuge of the incompetent.' Perhaps we need to focus on improving our competence rather than getting rid of guns.....and drugs.

Just my two cents.....
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Last edited by swampler; 12-21-2012 at 09:29 AM.. Reason: Removed vulgarity
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Old 12-16-2012   #19
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Default Re: Mental Illness Control (Gun Related)

It is a very slippery slope. I have depression and am medicated. Does that mean I am not of sound mind?

However, I also have Epilepsy. I have never found the right combination of meds to control my Seizures. To obtain a Drivers License in FL. I must be completely seizure free for 2 years. Have an Neurologist specializing in Epilepsy and Seizure medicine sign off that I am seizure free.

That is where the slippery slope comes in. With the type of Seizures I have, Simple Partials and occasionally a Complex Partial it would be exceedingly easy for me to lie.

Should I have a License? No.

Just for the hell of it I asked a lawyer and a cop if I could carry. Know what?
No. For the same criteria as above.

Should I be able to carry? No.
Can I go to a shooting range? No.

That, for me is the way it should be. However, depression does not and should not play a role.

Again, that is a slippery slope as there are so many forms of mental illness that the 'perfect' answer will be found.

Edit: Do we have guns in the house? Yes.
An 1862 Tower Musket, 2 BB guns.

Also, I wrote what I did because in my hands, a vehicle could be a weapon.

In 2002 I drove a 3/4 ton, 4WD Stick shift truck. 20 minutes after I arrived at work I had the one and only Grand Mal Seizure.
What if...

Now, if I were to lie in order to get my license back, would I be considered a murderer? Yes.

I am not equating vehicular homicide with firearm homicide. Just saying that I am responsible for my actions.

Which, leads to that slippery slope. What if I am unable to be responsible Therein lies the problem....
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Old 12-16-2012   #20
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Default Re: Mental Illness Control (Gun Related)

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That is where the slippery slope comes in. With the type of Seizures I have, Simple Partials and occasionally a Complex Partial it would be exceedingly easy for me to lie.

Should I have a License? No.

Just for the hell of it I asked a lawyer and a cop if I could carry. Know what?
No. For the same criteria as above.

Should I be able to carry? No.
Can I go to a shooting range? No.

That, for me is the way it should be. However, depression does not and should not play a role.

Again, that is a slippery slope as there are so many forms of mental illness that the 'perfect' answer will be found.
Even though I respect your decision not to use firearms, I don't understand why you feel that you shouldn't be allowed to carry or couldn't go to a shooting range even if you wanted to. I can understand the restriction on the driver's license: if you have a seizure while driving, the vehicle is still moving and can kill somebody. On the other hand, it's kinda hard to do damage with a gun unless you can pull the trigger.

In this case, I would be more worried about the depression than the seizures, though you would (theoretically) be of more danger to yourself than to others.


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