For Mark on Metz

[Nikonfreak]

Originally Posted by Mark McCall

Julio,
No TTL flash unit from any manufacturer is consistent enough for digital capture, especially in a wedding inviornment where things happen incredibly fast.
(unless used in full on manual mode, and who does that??)
I haven't seen any TTL based flash with a wink flash on the front. While not necessary, it's a gem in close quarters when your bouncing the main flash head.

I declined Canon's offer to sponsor one of my programs because, as part of the deal, I had to hype the 550 and 580EX flashes.
I couldn't do it, because I know they won't expose well enough or consistent enough for digital capture.
For the record, the 550EX is an awesome film flash where there's enough forgivness in the latitude to correct for the flash inconsistencies. I used it successfully with the EOS line of 35mm film cameras for years.

Yes, the flash is mounted directly over the lens with the CD Junior, in landscape or portrait angles.

I'm seeing the lack of consistency. I shot a kids birthday party two weeks ago and the ceilings were low (9 ft) at the place where it was held. My thoughts? Boom baby...bounce the flash off the ceiling and the flourescent lights won't be too much of an issue.

For most of the shots, I was pretty spot on bouncing the flash off the white ceiling. There were a number of shots where my white balance was a hair off and the shot seemed a bit darker. Yep, you guessed it. Flash inconsistency. This was the SB 800 fired on the D200.

Every shot where the flash fired properly and accurately, the WB and exposure was spot on. I would say out of 200 to 250 images from the party, about 15-20 were about a half stop off where it should have been... just enough to tick you off. A couple were my fault because I shot a follow up shot too quickly and didn't give the flash a chance to recycle and it fired, albeit low power, but that only accounted for 3 images that I recall.

So I'm looking at alternatives... I would still use my SB 800, but I don't have that unblinking confidence in it and that's what worries me.

Julio

[Mark McCall]

Originally Posted by dvdowns

I was concentrating on using the sharpest aperture and had the camera on aperture priority , I wasn't cheacking the speed the pictures were being taken at and totally forgot about maximum synch speed . I had 75% of it right but the other 25% was shutter speed .

I see. Kudos for using your brain in trying to get the sharpest images.
But for wedding work, forget about the sharpest shooting aperture. That really applies more in the portrait arena where your going to be selling large images.
Wedding clients rarely buy large prints so sharpness is never an issue (unless your just flat out of focus).
Try shooting at F5.6 on camera in manual mode. Flash on auto, set to F4 (the Metz will deliver F5.6 at the F4 setting), shutter speed at 30th or 15th.
Turn on the wink flash when you bounce.*
You'll be amazed.

Originally Posted by Nikonfreak

Boom baby...bounce the flash off the ceiling and the flourescent lights won't be too much of an issue
Julio

Not quite.
Ambient light, whether it be window light, flourescent or incandescent, is controlled by shutter speed.
All the bouncing in the world won't get rid of your ambient if your shutter speed is too long.
Faster shutter speed, like Desmond mentioned using, is killing any ambient light in the room, however, a 30th, a 15th or an 8th will allow the ambient to blend with the flash for a more pleasing image.

[Nikonfreak]

I should have mentioned I was shooting at 1/125 in shutter priority as kids were moving around.* With a 28-70, I figured I was safe from motion blur at that point and shortening it up enough to where flash was primary illumination.

Do you think that was still too slow?

Maybe that's why WB was off a hair or seemed to get flourescent bleed in?

Other shots at same settings seemed right on.. now you've got me thinking....

Julio

[Mark McCall]

Julio,
Never use Shutter Priority mode indoors. (matter of fact, I never use it at all).
And 125th is too fast.

The concept I've been teaching is that you set the flash to fire at a desired aperture in auto mode, and forget it. (this only works with a thyristor based flash like Metz, Vivitar, or Quantum.
The Nikon and Canon flashes do not have an auto mode, but rather a TTL mode. Very inconsistent.

Set your camera to manual mode. Set aperture to F5.6 and use one of the following shutter speeds: 30th, 15th or an 8th. The results will amaze you.

[Nikonfreak]

Originally Posted by Mark McCall

Julio,
Never use Shutter Priority mode indoors. (matter of fact, I never use it at all).
And 125th is too fast.

The concept I've been teaching is that you set the flash to fire at a desired aperture in auto mode, and forget it. (this only works with a thyristor based flash like Metz, Vivitar, or Quantum.
The Nikon and Canon flashes do not have an auto mode, but rather a TTL mode. Very inconsistent.

Set your camera to manual mode. Set aperture to F5.6 and use one of the following shutter speeds: 30th, 15th or an 8th. The results will amaze you.

Yep, my flash used there was the SB 800 and it was in straight TTL mode, not TTL-BL...

I'm going to do just that this coming weekend if I get the Metz by then. You've got me really intrigued and somewhat puzzled. It's lthe "Just get back to the basics"... hard to believe it's really that simple.

I've been reading up on the Quantums. I was looking at those as well as the Metz flash units.

I'm reminded of that movie with Kurt Russel where he is going nuts trying to learn to fly with all the controls and functions... the instructor tells him to "Relax and just fly the plane".

Julio

[dvdowns]

Is the flash inconsistency not just because the camera is on spot focus or something ? wouldn't matrx metering give more consistent results ?

[Mark McCall]

Nope.
No TTL mode is consistent, regardless of metering mode.

To make flash work with digital SLR's of any brand, and do it consistently, you'll need to use an automatic style flash that can meter itself, and keep the camera on manual.

Imagine shooting an entire wedding without changing a single thing on the camera or flash, with the expection of the occasional change in shutter speed to lighten or darken a background.

Trust me guys....this works, and it really is that simple.

[captlen]

SOLD* i took my 10d to an out door* function to night with my new metz 54mz-4 As you suggested, Mark, I set it on auto, f5.6 shutter at 30th ISO 100.* I had a sto-fen style diffuser on on at about 45 degree angle with the "wink" light on.* the only problem I had is it seems that the metz recycles a bit slower than my canon 550ex so for three shots the flash did not fire it had not recycled.* Other than that 100% of the shots were exposed perfectly.* TTL has never delivered results like this. I admit I was a skeptic.* Now I am a believer.

I reccomend for eveyone, like myself, before you try to explain why it is not going to work, just try it.

Thanks Mark, this will mean dollars to the bottom line.*

[dvdowns]

What about the wedding I did were the formalities were held under a white tarpaulin that made my camera go to 1/850th of a second ? I take it the white tarp would just be a total 'whiteout' in the pictures ?

[Mark McCall]

Captlen,
Awesome.
Your flash is recycling slower because of the 100 ISO which requires more flash power. The wink flash is also using up some power.
For indoor, and outdoor night shots, try 400 ISO. The 10D delivers amazingly clean files at 400 ISO.
I use 400 exclusively for all work outside the studio, with an occasional dip into 800 for really dark reception halls.
Try using the wink flash only when you bounce off a ceiling. You really don't need the wink flash with the Stoffen.

Desmond,
What ISO were you shooting at? Was this during the day?
The higher the ISO, the higher your shutter speed will be in aperture priority mode.
Also, hotspots or highlights will fool your in-camera meter.
You may have had extenuating circumstances, but my system will still work in your tarp situation, just use a slightly faster shutter speed, probably around 60th.
IGNORE the in-camera meter unless your shooting outdoors in daylight.