Can't Believe it's Basketball Season Already!

[swampler]

Opening home game tonight. Here's a few to share.

[Songman45]

Doesn't basketball run 11 out of 12 months at some level? I swear basketball and baseball have the longest seasons. Nice shots Steve.

[swampler]

I know it normally starts in November (I just thought later Nov) and runs through March madness (doesn't that run into April?) and I think the pros go even later. And WNBA may be even different from that. Argh!

Thanks for commenting. They put in new lights (fluorescent instead of sodium vapor) and the gym is even darker this year than last! Why would they do that!?

[Songman45]

Originally Posted by swampler

They put in new lights (fluorescent instead of sodium vapor) and the gym is even darker this year than last! Why would they do that!?

It must be the "how do we jack with the photographers" deamon sitting on someone's shoulder. There seems to be an epidemic going around seeing who can create the most cave like gym. Our local high school (like many in the area) recently built a new school and the lighting in the gym is horrid. Standard fare lighting, mercury vapor lights. The school's colors are maroon and gold so the powers that be decided the walls should be painted maroon up to about 12 feet and white from there up. Sometimes I think I'd have to strike a match to see if the lights are on.

[swampler]

It's probably "green" lighting. My sports editor was saying at the local dungeon, err high school, they were going to have flashlight night were everyone in the audience will shine flashlights at the court...I hope he was joking.

[PeterB]

Nice shots Steve.
Looks as if your right into the swing of it for the first round.
The only thing I can see is that they look a bit noisy to me. Try running through a noise program like neat image or noiseware pro.
Great job

[swampler]

Thanks, Peter. They are a bit noisy as I shot them at ISO 12800, f/2.8, 1/640. I had been using Dfine, but it runs like crap now that I use Windows 7. Not sure what the deal is there. Next time I shoot there, I plan to try my 85 f/1.8 since the lights have gotten so bad.

[motox424]

Steve-

2 questions(maybe 3)

#1--can you use fash for the games?
#2--do you have a speedlite?

YES #3--are you willing to use a speedlite?

Although your photos are clear, crisp, etcc.. the would be really great if not for the noise. I wish iI had your camera(the 50D)with high ISO capabilities, but I don't, and have to rely on flash(now strobes - 2 AB 800's) but have been shooting a bounced 580EXll for B-ball and V-ball for the last 2 years with "decent' results.

I know you know what your doing, it's just that you could really produce some amazing shots "IF" you'd use flash in those dungeons

I hope I haven't offended you in anyway as I enjoy viewing your work

[swampler]

Scott,

No offense at all. I'm not sure if flash is allowed or not at the college games, which is where this was, but I may ask. Then again, if I use my 85 f/1.8, I should be able to get ISO 3200, 1/400 at f/1.8 with little to no noise (at least much more usable)...assuming that's enough DOF to get sharp shots. If I do decide to use my speed light, then I would want to get a bracket as I don't like redeye, but I would be able to use lower ISO and keep using my 70-200 in that gym.

That said, I printed an 8x10 from one of the girl's game at the same 12800 ISO and it looked better than they look on screen.

[cyclohexane]

All of these are framed a little too tight; I feel like many of these would be more interesting a little wider, i.e. at 50mm or so.

The first one is blurry; the jersey is in focus, but his face is out.

, if I use my 85 f/1.8, I should be able to get ISO 3200, 1/400 at f/1.8 with little to no noise (at least much more usable)...assuming that's enough DOF to get sharp shots

The DOF is fine, provided you nail your focus, but at 1/400" you'll suffer in the motion blur department.

[swampler]

Thanks for commenting, Michael. The only 50mm lens I have is the 50 f/1.8, which I doubt would be fast enough focusing for basketball.

What would you recommend as far as shooting in this dark of a college gym? There are bleachers on both sides, but only 1 side has a railing for mounting remote strobes. Strobes on a tripod would be easily knocked over / damaged, so that leaves me with an on camera flash unless you have a better solution.

Thanks for any ideas you can throw my way!

[cyclohexane]

What would you recommend as far as shooting in this dark of a college gym?

High ISO, and praying. Easiest solution. Also, get ready to bin a lot of shots.

Otherwise, we're talking spending money, and that's never really a great solution.

There are bleachers on both sides, but only 1 side has a railing for mounting remote strobes.

You can clamp strobes to only that one side, and shoot available light on the other side. Don't use a tripod or a stand; it's really not worth it.

If they let you use an on-camera flash, it's worth a try, but I'm not a huge fan of the look. Also, the last time I use on-camera flash at a basketball game, I was in high school and had no clue what I was doing. =)

The only 50mm lens I have is the 50 f/1.8, which I doubt would be fast enough focusing for basketball.

You could always give it a try, but you're probably right. I used to use an 85mm f/1.4 for basketball, but it suffered slightly in focusing speed. I switched back to a 70-200 f/2.8 and 300 f/2.8 combination.

[swampler]

So, basically keep doing what I've been doing, uh? I may try the 85 f/1.8 at ISO 6400, then for a faster shutter speed than 1/400, maybe f/2 @ 1/640 and see how that does. Worst case, I can spend the money on a flash bracket and cord, if allowed there.

The high school I shoot at is set up perfect for mounting flashes to a rail as there's a balcomy over and behind the goals on each end. What exactly would I need to do this? I have a 430EX which does NOT have a place for a sync cord to plug in and I have a Nikon flash, but don't know right off if it has a sync cord connector or not. I know I need a clamp (recommendation?), and wireless hot shoe receiver (?), and wireless transmitter. I already have 1 transmitter and receiver for my studio strobe. Is there a hot shoe that will accept that receiver?

Hope the questions make sense.

[cyclohexane]

For a small gym, with small strobes, see this: Lighting High School gyms

Clamp wise, I recommend either the Bogen/Manfrotto Justin Clamp or the Bogen/Manfrotto Super Clamp. You want the one with the long plastic handle, not the Bogen/Avenger Super Clamp that is identical except it has this knob in lieu of the handle which is much harder to get tightended down.

The Justin Clamp has everything you need to get going and is easier to set-up, but is less secure than the Super Clamp. The Super Clamp, once tightened down, stays there, but you'll need a way to attach your flash- usually an umbrella adapter or small ballhead with coldshoe attached. I don't have much experience with the Justin Clamp, otherwise I'd probably just recommend it outright for the very temporary installations you're probably doing in the high school gym.

Don't forget safety cables. I have no idea who manufacturers the ones I have, but they look like the ones in the two links.

I already have 1 transmitter and receiver for my studio strobe. Is there a hot shoe that will accept that receiver?

Not sure what radio triggers you are using, but this might work with it: LumoPro Hot Shoe Universal Translator with Female PC and 1/8" (3.5mm) Miniphone

------

If you're really crafty and don't mind a long set-up time, you can hard wire the small strobes pretty inexpensively using 18/2 zip line from Radio Shack (or Home Depot or similar), some "Add-A-Taps", gaffer's tape, zip ties, and some sync cords that have male household one on one end, and whatever you need for your flashes on the other.

Clamp the strobes at their locations, run a zip line from the strobes to your shooting location. Plug the strobes into the zip line using add-a-taps and your sync cords, and then use another add-a-tap to plug in a PC sync to male household cord for your camera. Use tape and zip ties to keep the zip line out of the way. Your strobes will fire pretty much every time (unlike radios), but it's now become a lot harder to move. Also, you need to run zip line to each side.

What you may be able to do, depending on your relationship with the school, is install a "permanent" zip line out of the way, with drop lines for plugging your camera in that can be stowed when not in use, and just plug your strobes and camera in whenever you show up at the gym.

[lputman]

Originally Posted by cyclohexane

High ISO, and praying. Easiest solution. Also, get ready to bin a lot of shots.

That's what I do!

[PeterB]

Steve your suggestion of the 85m@ 1.8 and your iso @ 6400 will give you a good shutter speed. Dont worry about the noise. You can remove that later on. The important thing here is a fast shutter to freeze the action. Without strobes or a speedlight you must shoot nothing below 1/500 sec otherwise blur will accur.
If your still struggling then I agree with what "cyclohexane" says.
Good luck.

[swampler]

Thanks, Peter. I played with the 85 f/1.8 at the same gym and felt the focus wasn't very consistent, so it's back to the 70-200 for me. I did notice another photog using bounce flash there (not that there's anything close by to bounce off of), so I'll try that next time.

I actually printed one of my ISO 12800 shots at 8x10, without any extra noise reduction, and was quite surprised at how good it looked. None of the noise showing up on the screen was visible in the photo, but there was some banding in the reds visible from up close. At normal viewing distances, it wasn't noticeable.