Gina

[JimH]

A little hesitant to post these since as I found out in this thread ... I did them wrong. Regardless, said I would and here they are. (oh .. and I don't know the first thing about sports pictures - but she insisted).

So, let's see ... hair light too hot in the first one and posed wrong, hair chopped and no crop room in the second one (and I didn't know what I was doing), wrinkles in the bd and hair didn't stay behind ear (camera left) on the third.

Everyone else please have at them. Your C&C has been invaluable in my learning process!

Oh, and I added an avatar today.

[k9ofkaos]

Jim, your own CC is totally valid, but I don't think they're as bad as all that. You have an excellent start on doing good portraits and you'll only get better.

BTW: I completely disagree with you about the hair behind the ears. I love hair and I don't like the hair behind the ear look at all, but that's just my preference.

[PetersenPhotography]

Great job!!

The hair thing isn't a problem for me in #3 - that's my favorite one of the three. I think the head was tilted too much in #1. Personally, I think #2 is cool, chopped hair and crop room aside. It's very imposing - makes her look like a force to be reckoned with on the field!

The only nitpick on #2 would be that her feet are not symetrically angled. Since you've got her square to the camera and dead center, the symmetry discrepancy is apparent. The other thing, now that I'm seeing it, is that her knees are not angeled symmetrically either. That's hard to control with a person in front of you, of course, but you said to "have at them".

I doubt I could have done as well as you did - please don't take my comments as anything other than me trying to learn by observing and putting my thoughts down. I think this is top notch stuff!

Nic

[harryd]

Jim it sounds like you and I are doing the same thing, I see my mistakes but not before I shoot them. You are doing great and so glad your hear learning with us. Never worry about posting and keep on learning with the rest of us. I know I learn more from my mistakes that my successes.

BTW; Love the avatar,

[JimH]

Originally Posted by k9ofkaos

Jim, your own CC is totally valid, but I don't think they're as bad as all that. You have an excellent start on doing good portraits and you'll only get better.

BTW: I completely disagree with you about the hair behind the ears. I love hair and I don't like the hair behind the ear look at all, but that's just my preference.

Thanks Mojo ... appreciate the kind words! I keep looking back to the first one and wondering, if the image would look better with the hair tuck. She is very pleased, so that will suffice for now - just don't want to fall into that trap of good enough

Originally Posted by PetersenPhotography

Great job!!

The hair thing isn't a problem for me in #3 - that's my favorite one of the three. I think the head was tilted too much in #1. Personally, I think #2 is cool, chopped hair and crop room aside. It's very imposing - makes her look like a force to be reckoned with on the field!

The only nitpick on #2 would be that her feet are not symetrically angled. Since you've got her square to the camera and dead center, the symmetry discrepancy is apparent. The other thing, now that I'm seeing it, is that her knees are not angeled symmetrically either. That's hard to control with a person in front of you, of course, but you said to "have at them".

I doubt I could have done as well as you did - please don't take my comments as anything other than me trying to learn by observing and putting my thoughts down. I think this is top notch stuff!

Nic - Comment all you want. That's probably why i love this site so much. Real honest answers withOUT a bunch of know-it-alls trying to rub your face in what you did wrong.

As for the leg symmetry ... over thinking on my part. Jumped back and forth between symmetrical and moving things out of place to try some sense of motion or action .. or .. who knows what I was thinking. Force to be reckoned with .. may post the "outakes" of her flexing and the full length bench with my 36v DeWalt drill over in the snapshot area.

Originally Posted by harryd

Jim it sounds like you and I are doing the same thing, I see my mistakes but not before I shoot them. You are doing great and so glad your hear learning with us. Never worry about posting and keep on learning with the rest of us. I know I learn more from my mistakes that my successes.

BTW; Love the avatar,

Harry - LOL - exactly what I was thinking when I was composing the OP. Why the hell can't I do this as I am going?

Thanks to all of you for being honest and forthright!

[patterfr]

Jim
We are all learning. I agree it is so hard to remember everything when you are shooting, and it is very easy to see after.
Here's the thing about these. If you were really good at Photoshop I think you could make these look great. THe purists are probably cringing, but if you look at all the realy good images on this forum, they've undergone a lot of post work usually. So, don't be so hard on yourself. For instance, it would take 30 seconds to drop the "hotness" of the hairlight in #1. #2 I like, throw a B&W processing and a vignette and it's a cool sports portrait. Etc.
I bet the more you shoot, the more you and others look critically at them, the less things you forget.

[JimH]

Originally Posted by patterfr

Jim
We are all learning. I agree it is so hard to remember everything when you are shooting, and it is very easy to see after.
Here's the thing about these. If you were really good at Photoshop I think you could make these look great. THe purists are probably cringing, but if you look at all the realy good images on this forum, they've undergone a lot of post work usually. So, don't be so hard on yourself. For instance, it would take 30 seconds to drop the "hotness" of the hairlight in #1. #2 I like, throw a B&W processing and a vignette and it's a cool sports portrait. Etc.
I bet the more you shoot, the more you and others look critically at them, the less things you forget.

Thanks Fran. I tend to try not to do TO much PP when posting here for C&C. Seems like it kinda defeats the purpose to try to make the "perfect image" and then expect good critique. Primarily trying to get the lighting right, then secondarily the posing. When i can get those nailed down then I'll concentrate on the PP a little more heavily. As for these and the other (Sabrina), used the Benji trick of toning the R value to 240, spot healing the blemishes, a very light skin smoothing and remove the secondary catchlights.

Gonna schedule some more time with them (they had a blast) for a round two with all the great stuff you and the others have brought to light.

[patterfr]

Originally Posted by jhilgedick

Thanks Fran. I tend to try not to do TO much PP when posting here for C&C. Seems like it kinda defeats the purpose to try to make the "perfect image" and then expect good critique.

That's an interesting way to look at it. I'm not saying you are wrong, but I always thought that if I fixed everything that I saw, then others would be able to pick up things that I didn't (and I usually still leave plenty of opportunity.)

I wonder if I'm wrong about it and what other people do. I always thought that I would try to show my absolute best efforts ( I know that's kind of sad).

For instance if I post a shot with what I think is great lighting, and leave a wrinkly BG then someone's gonna say "I'd smooth out the BG) and I'd think that was a missed opportunity to gain from their knowledge.

Now you got me worried that everyone's even better than I thought.


I wonder what everyone else thinks.

[mc_stoo]

I love #2, based on the expression and pose... being picky I'd argue that the crop is just a little tight to the top of her hair but otherwise great. The facial expressions in #1 and #3 seem a little 'forced' or at best uncomfortable.

[Harry]

Hair behind the ears looks ok to me. Not sure if I care for the body towards the light posing, but it doesn't look unflattering. Maybe a little bounce in the baseball shot. No. 4 is butt ugly. BTW, is that shot with your new D300. (stupid question)

[Athena]

You already know all the little nit picks, so I'll just say that #2 is my favorite. She looks so natural like that.

I also like your new avatar. Great to have faces with names.

[KellyL]

Great advice given. And all photos, whether print or digital, undergo processing. If it isn't on the computer, it is in the darkroom.

Turn her body away from the light and her head back into it. In the first image, her head is turned correctly, now turn her body so her back is to the light. Then it would be first rate.

For bench shots, angle the bench to the camera so they aren't straight on.

You have some excellent beginnings here and are soon going to be flying.

[JimH]

Originally Posted by patterfr

That's an interesting way to look at it. I'm not saying you are wrong, but I always thought that if I fixed everything that I saw, then others would be able to pick up things that I didn't (and I usually still leave plenty of opportunity.)

I wonder if I'm wrong about it and what other people do. I always thought that I would try to show my absolute best efforts ( I know that's kind of sad).

For instance if I post a shot with what I think is great lighting, and leave a wrinkly BG then someone's gonna say "I'd smooth out the BG) and I'd think that was a missed opportunity to gain from their knowledge.

Now you got me worried that everyone's even better than I thought.


I wonder what everyone else thinks.

I think everyone has a different way of looking at things and I kinda picked up on that here. Of the images I have posted over the last couple of months, there are a select few that will give an honest C&C of what they see. Meanwhile, other posts go on and on with a broad spectrum of the camel community. Don't get me wrong, not trying to be selective, catering or pandering to a particular group, but the people you see in this thread for example are the opinion's that matter most to me.

[PetersenPhotography]

One other thought I had on #2. If you had her step a little more away from the BG, you wouldn't see as many creases and wrinkles. That, of couse, would necessitate you moving back as well, and, not being where you are, I don't know if you have the room to do that.

Just another thought I had looking over the post again. I still love the feel of #2!

[JimH]

Originally Posted by Harry

No. 4 is butt ugly. BTW, is that shot with your new D300. (stupid question)

Takes one to know one

The D300? Yes .. as a matter of fact it is. You know the old adage about "it's not the camera, it's the photographer"? BS. This tool has made life MUCH easier for me in image capture.

Originally Posted by Athena

You already know all the little nit picks, so I'll just say that #2 is my favorite. She looks so natural like that.

I also like your new avatar. Great to have faces with names.

Thank you so much

Originally Posted by KellyL

Turn her body away from the light and her head back into it.

Yep - we wen't over that in the Sabrina images. these were done at the same time. promise to do it right next time

Originally Posted by KellyL

For bench shots, angle the bench to the camera so they aren't straight on.

Started out that way actually - got some weired banding effects with the lighting ... so quickly discarded that idea until I had some time to figure out what that was all about.

[JimH]

Originally Posted by PetersenPhotography

One other thought I had on #2. If you had her step a little more away from the BG, you wouldn't see as many creases and wrinkles. That, of couse, would necessitate you moving back as well, and, not being where you are, I don't know if you have the room to do that.

She was at about 5.5 to 6 feet. I could probably drop the BG down some to pull it out and forward more then switch from the 85 to the 50 to give myself some framing room. I can back up from subject about sixteen feet.

[00silvergt]

Nice series, I like all three, great job!

[JimH]

Originally Posted by 00silvergt

Nice series, I like all three, great job!

Thank you 00silver!