Selling cd's of images...help!

[Ellbee99]

Ok... normally we photograph 1 or 2 weddings a year...this year I'm doing about 10 so far...so here is my question...
How do you deal with clients who constantly ask for the images on a cd?
Our rule has always been to say, "no." Repeated sales after the wedding is one reason but, also our name is tied to our portraits...if they print them and they look like crap my name is smeared.
My own sister printed some images from a cd I provided to her from my niece's wedding. My mom opened a framed 8x10 for Cmas and it was garbage! I was shocked! I spent countless hours color correcting and retouching these images. My sister printed these and gave them as a gift and my skills looked like crap! My niece did the same thing and sent them in thank you's! I'm so embarrased! If family does this...what about a stranger? There goes my reputation!

I just read this thread : Why do you give the house away by providing CD? and there are a lot of valid points there.

My questions are:
Should a pro ever actually sell their images on a cd?

If so how much is a reasonable amount to charge (I live in a poor rural area...my top wedding coverage starts at $1,695 for 8 hours, 1 16x20(framed) and a 10x15 album? I know I need to raise my prices but, that is another topic altogether)

If I do sell them should they be only the candids and unretouched?

Make them have to come back to me for formal portraits?

Only sell the cd if they purchase a substantial portrait order?

I understand not want to cut up an $8 4x6 for scrapbooking but, I don't want to get taken either. If I offer a scrapbooking 4x6 deal, how can I then justify $8 for another 4x6?

I appreciate everyone's help.
Thank you in advance.
Lori

[Ed Shapiro]

Hi Lori!

This is a very important issue and although it appears on various forums time and time again, its importance is not diminished.

Every time I post my opinions on this subject I am usually set upon but many of the younger photographers and those who consider providing printable files to customers as a standard policy. I get a lot of "you are "old school" - "you don't wanna keep up with current trends- etc.- etc"!

So... in keeping with my reputation for being a crotchety old geezer who does not necessarily want to be "trendy" when it is detrimental to my business, I'll respond to the "old school" argument in advance; BALDERDASH! Here's why:

For many decades, professional photographers have protected their images in terms of not releasing negatives or unmarked proofs to their clients. The were not "old fashioned" or archaic- they just realized that their images were their stock in trade and that they needed the exclusivity of producing prints from their own negatives in order to reap the benefits of their own art, making a living and continue controlling the quality of the work that is attributed to themselves or their studios- makes good sense to me.

This business of providing printable files is thought of by many, as a product of the digital age but long before digital cameras existed there were photographers who provided negatives and even undeveloped film to their customers- just receiving a shooting fee and allowing the client to engage in a do-it-yourself project with their images which oftentimes did turn out to be sub-standard having been processed at the "drug store" or supermarket film drop off- nowadays it Wal-Mart!

Historically, the high quality studios, however, avoided theses practices and the clients became accustomed to receiving quality images and were not necessarily interested in having culled proofs or giant quantities of images that would end up in a drawer. Well crafted and story telling albums and elegant portraits were the preferred products and in some cases, still are.

The digital age, however, does make DVDs and CDs more desirable to clients because of the immediacy involved with computer technology. Just about everyone has a computer and having a disk of an entire wedding coverage is a natural- the can even print the images on cheap photo or bond paper if the wish. In the olden days, not everyone had a darkroom and printing professional size large and medium format negatives was not the domain of the average photofinishing lab. Nowadays- everyone can "play" their wedding along with all their bootleg copies of videos and music. MY THEORY AND PRACTICE IS THAT PROFESSIONAL PHOTOGRAPHERS DO NOT HAVE TO CATER TO THESES NEEDS and would be better off offering a more artistically and high quality oriented product. If people really want a playable DVD with proper editing, voice over and music, they should be charged as if theses were albums and produce them with style and quality.

NOW- realistically- I can't impose this method on anyone, especially if I am nor familiar with the socioeconomic situation in their operating area. My clients are basically from urban and suburban areas and range, financially, from middle to high income. I also serve rural areas and farming communities but folks there can afford my fees. Some people feel that there clients are from low to middle income families but are oftentimes shocked when the see what some of theses folks spend with wedding vendors. I have had clients come in to my office and just about plead poverty and surprisingly enough have pulled off some rather lavish weddings. In some cases it is not even a matter of the money- it is rather a matter of their priorities. Some couples will brake the bank with food, booze and a big band and spend little on their photography. Others will allocate more money to their photography and be more conservative with more disposable items for their weddings.

So Lori- I wish I could come up with more definitive answers to your questions. My advice would be to offer a superior product in therms of craftsmanship, artistry and a really high end professional album oriented products so that the CDs become a secondary issue and perhaps offer the CD as a bonus which is made available to clients who have given you sizable print, album or portrait orders.

I feel strongly that your reputation as a quality oriented photographer is invaluable in comparison to a few small bookings that you may get by offering the "whole house".

In the days when I was giving seminars, my "students" would revere my every word, smile and nod their heads as I was thatching and their only negative opinion would surface at the end of a two to five day class and that was "That's all very nice, but it won't work in my town"! How anticlimactic is that- how frustrating? The only saving grace for me was that the few that tried some of my advice, reported back to me that there were doing very well by introducing some or all of my policies and ideas.

The main thing to consider here is that the bad new news of "NO CDs" has to be accompanied by the good news that "you are gonna be receiving the best work in town"!

Another thing to note; Take a look at the music and motion picture industry. They (and law enforcement agencies) are really clamping down on copyright infringement and unlawful copying and distribution of their creative material. The have the time and the money to lobby governments and throw their weight around. As small business people we have to fend for ourselves but the laws still exist and I think the public is going to have to get used to the fact that artists of all kinds need to keep control and profit from their own work.

I also realize that is hard to buck an "established practice" once it is misconstrued as an "industry standard practice". Nobody can tell you that you have to conform to anyone else's policies even if those policies are detrimental yo your livelihood.

I hope this helps a little bit in your comming up with a fair and equitable policy for your business.

Ed

[Ellbee99]

Thank you so much Ed for your sage advice. I think you basically validated what I was already sure of. I can offer my clients wonderful retouching and PP work on my images. I use a wonderful lab and I can provide them with images that will blow them away. I should stick to my guns and not let a cd of images out of my posession...no matter what the price, it is not worth soiling my reputation. I am going to start offering leather bound albums or coffee table books and they can put extra images in those. I do state my no cd policy upfront but, when they start asking after the fact...I question myself. I guess I need to find a back bone!

Let them get cds from their friends and relatives...if my name will be on it...I want my quality standards there too!

If I do offer anything it will be a dvd finished album...one they won't be able to get images off of. They will also be paying for it and only with a sizeable order.

As my husband always says our real competition is not other photographers...it is ATVs, SUVs and bass boats....people have just so much disposable income...hopefully they will choose to use it to purchase cherished images that will last a life time!

Thanks again...
Lori

[jfrancho]

Duplicate posts are confusing and unecessary. Deja vu: How do you handle this...images on cd...help?

[Ellbee99]

Originally Posted by jfrancho

Duplicate posts are confusing and unecessary. Deja vu: How do you handle this...images on cd...help?

If you are easily confused, ignore one.

One was in weddings and one in photo talk ...different audiences.
Thanks for responding.
Lori

[jfrancho]

In my opinion, the two threads should be merged and moved to the Business of Photography forum. YMMV.