Trouble with Reds

[waxkingrm]

I've been having trouble with my reds using Adobe Camera Raw. I tried some different default profiles people on other forums suggested and they still did not look right. I haven't calibrated my monitor and am not a pro or do I want to be. I've known the reds in my bird pictures were wrong and have been unable to correct it.

Nobody on this forum ever mentioned it. I don't understand why. They just say nice capture etc. etc. I read other forums also but mostly only post here. I like the friendly nature of this forum, but I wish people would be more honest. I want to be told when my picture is wrong or bad even if you don't tell me why. At least then I can ask someone else what is wrong. When everyone tells you nice picture then you tend to believe it. I know there are some very good photographers on this forum(much better than I will ever be), but only seldom does anyone tell someone that their picture is not the greatest.

Well, that's my rant for now. I guess I will have to put a disclaimer at the bottom of my posts such as: Please critique, I am not thin skinned and I can take whatever bad things you have to say. I even have a better idea. We should have an option in everyone's profile for giving permission to criticize, and another option giving permission for others to copy and photoshop correct a posted file. I'm not sure if this would be possible but I think its a good idea.

Back to the Reds. I found out on other forums that ACR has problems with reds and that DPP handles them much better. Below I am posting two files, one with ACR reds and one with DPP reds. I left most everything at default but exposure, brightness and contrast and then doing an auto level. I think the DPP looks much better, but this is just my judgement. What do you think.

[waxkingrm]

5D DPP

[cyclohexane]

Go to the "Calibrate" tab in ACR (I'm using CS1, btw), and shift the Red Hue slider until you like the red.* I used "Red -15" on this one of a fellow Photocamel member:



This isn't the best example, but it was the first image I had handy with a sizable chunk of red in it. "Red -15" is my default setting when converting files from my D2H.

[waxkingrm]

I have been using a default of -12 for Red Hue and a Plus 24 for Red Saturation. I've tried values in between these and still have not found one that makes the Cardinal look right in ACR. With DPP I didn't have to do anything, and to me, it looks right. I haven't noticed a problem with my reds in pictures other than birds. I think I am just more attuned to what the color of a Cardinal should look like.

[dc2]

It has been a topic but a while ago, about canon sensors* after the D60 not giving the nicest of skin colors [to much reds] I think you may have come along after the topic had run its course for a while .
Some times I look at the pics from my 1ds2 and think the reds and possibly the blues feels more saturated than my old 10D.
I have wondered if canon are going to upgrade the firmware to bring the colors into a more natural state in camera :-\

[waxkingrm]

Thanks dc2,
Do you shoot in RAW using ACR? If so what are your defaults set to for saturation, Red Hue, and Red Saturation? Do you think the picture above using DPP has the better reds?

[dc2]

From looking at this the DPP seems more saturated with the red
and my problem and the ones I have heard people complain about with the canon sensor is
its already too saturated in the reds.[most noticeable on skin tones]
Yes I use ACR but tend to leave most the colors on default and if I have a lot of pics with too much red I will drop the red satuartion until I am happy with it and apply that to that batch of images in one go.

[waxkingrm]

I agree dc2, it does look too saturated on this display. I was using my notebook before and it looked right. I use 3 or 4 different computers with different displays and a picture looks right on one, but when I use another it looks wrong. I'm using a front projection DLP which is calibrated very close to D65 now. In a dark room this display is fairly accurate with colors. I guess I shouldn't worry about it so much since it is just a hobby, but these red birds are giving me fits. I had to use the notebook for the DPP because the resolution on this display is 1280 x 720 and DPP won't work on anything less than 768. Thanks again.

[dc2]

Originally Posted by waxkingrm

I agree dc2, it does look too saturated on this display. I was using my notebook before and it looked right. I use 3 or 4 different computers with different displays and a picture looks right on one, but when I use another it looks wrong. I'm using a front projection DLP which is calibrated very close to D65 now. In a dark room this display is fairly accurate with colors. I guess I shouldn't worry about it so much since it is just a hobby, but these red birds are giving me fits. I had to use the notebook for the DPP because the resolution on this display is 1280 x 720 and DPP won't work on anything less than 768. Thanks again.

Your right its just a hobby but one we pay enough for So we are entitled to worry

[dvdowns]

Remember too that when we see a picture of a bird , not all of us know what colour that bird should be so to some of us it could be a nice picture of an orange bird . It is a "nice capture " of an orange bird until we know it should have been red as you have told us . Hope you come right with the processing , even the greens look better in the second post .

[Jon]

A Desmond pointed out above, I don't know what it's *supposed* to look like, but I personally prefer the first post- the second post is, to my eye, an unnaturally high red saturation. That being said, nature has some strange colors...

[waxkingrm]

Thanks for the advice guys,
I guess I need to get a calibration program. I agree the images were both oversatured. I deleted the originals and replaced with a copy after turning down the saturation in photoshop -12 on each. Still something about the colors of each that doesn't look quite right to me. That's a good point about not being sure about if a color is right because of variance in nature and also many here may never have seen the actual bird.

[dvdowns]

If you want to really confues us ask if a picture of a chameleon is the right colour

[ascending Phoenix]

Originally Posted by waxkingrm

I've been having trouble with my reds using Adobe Camera Raw. I tried some different default profiles people on other forums suggested and they still did not look right. I haven't calibrated my monitor and am not a pro or do I want to be. I've known the reds in my bird pictures were wrong and have been unable to correct it.

Nobody on this forum ever mentioned it. I don't understand why. They just say nice capture etc. etc. I read other forums also but mostly only post here. I like the friendly nature of this forum, but I wish people would be more honest. I want to be told when my picture is wrong or bad even if you don't tell me why. At least then I can ask someone else what is wrong. When everyone tells you nice picture then you tend to believe it. I know there are some very good photographers on this forum(much better than I will ever be), but only seldom does anyone tell someone that their picture is not the greatest.

Well, that's my rant for now. I guess I will have to put a disclaimer at the bottom of my posts such as: Please critique, I am not thin skinned and I can take whatever bad things you have to say. I even have a better idea. We should have an option in everyone's profile for giving permission to criticize, and another option giving permission for others to copy and photoshop correct a posted file. I'm not sure if this would be possible but I think its a good idea.

Back to the Reds. I found out on other forums that ACR has problems with reds and that DPP handles them much better. Below I am posting two files, one with ACR reds and one with DPP reds. I left most everything at default but exposure, brightness and contrast and then doing an auto level. I think the DPP looks much better, but this is just my judgement. What do you think.

NOT a slam..just looks like whjat I am fighting with my recently aquired Canon 20D using older film 4.5/5.6 lenses..noise/grain past point of focus..and over saturated reds that I have learned to control most times by and adjustment layer/selective color RED and lighting slightly..but the muddy noise is agrivating me.Even after BIOS UPDATE