Posed Dance Portraits

[R-V]

Good Morning,

I am going to set up home studio today. Wish I had a dedicated studio.
What type lighting is use to pose ballet, jazz, and tap dancers in costume. Ballet is a Poddle Skirt, the others are floppy pants. Colors have a lot of black and brights. If you can help I would greatly appreciate it.

Rus

[Alfred D.]

I would choose between either hard, directional (spot) light and a stage-type background (empty and black), or very soft light, almost wrap-around, with very open shadows, and a high-key, out-of-DoF pastel coloured background.
Better: don't choose, shoot 'm both.

[Jacco]

Originally Posted by R-V

Good Morning,

I am going to set up home studio today. Wish I had a dedicated studio.
What type lighting is use to pose ballet, jazz, and tap dancers in costume. Ballet is a Poddle Skirt, the others are floppy pants. Colors have a lot of black and brights.

That sounds like you're set to get a high contrast range in your images, which your digital camera – if set to shoot JPG or TIFF – will not be able to capture. Highlights will either be blown out, or shadows will be all black without any definition. Or both, of course.

You can tackle that by shooting in RAW format, then in PP create different TIFFs with different exposure settings from a single RAW file: say 3 TIFFs 2 stops apart, or 5 TIFFs 1 stop apart. Then you blend/merge them using HDR technique to create an image with well-balanced contrast.

[Songman45]

Jacco as much as I can appreciate your aparent broad knowledge of image manipulation I don't think you quite get it where this kind of work is involved. All that post processing takes time. Shooting a dance class is like shooting team sports. For the sake of profitability and immediate delvery of a suitable product a blance has to be struck. I can't see the market for these kinds of images justifying the addidional labor.

[Jacco]

Originally Posted by Songman45

Jacco as much as I can appreciate your aparent broad knowledge of image manipulation I don't think you quite get it where this kind of work is involved. All that post processing takes time. Shooting a dance class is like shooting team sports. For the sake of profitability and immediate delvery of a suitable product a blance has to be struck. I can't see the market for these kinds of images justifying the addidional labor.

"For the sake of profitability and immediate delvery"... and no PP? That sounds like 'mere' snapshots to me. Almost Polaroids!
The difference between a snapshooter and a photographer lies in the composition, lighting, timing, and in the quality of the delivered image. The latter will be vastly different if proper PP is applied.

"I can't see the market for these kinds of images justifying the addidional labor."
I can: if it's for the yearbook photo, or if it's to be used for promotion, like in ads, brochures, folders, or on posters, etc. etc.

[TimAndrea]

i am currently working on dance pics myself. i shot with a rim, a main up high and a fill low on the other side. used a large softbox for the main, umbrella on the fill and straight for the rim. and i dont think songman meant no processing but the PP you are talking about would take forever! I do that for the dance shots that i am doing for me, not what i am shoot en mass. about the only thing i do is hit f3, which does a minor level adjust, sharpen, and closes the pic. or use the batch tool. and this is even taking me months. they would never get their images if i shot raw, converted, hdr'd and all that! besides, you should get it right in camera and not have to do a lot to it. (of course for those wow shots that are special i take time out to do all that.)

[Jacco]

It's the 'Wow' shots that get me new and repeat business. I guess that's different where you are.

[Songman45]

Originally Posted by TimAndrea

i am currently working on dance pics myself. i shot with a rim, a main up high and a fill low on the other side. used a large softbox for the main, umbrella on the fill and straight for the rim. and i dont think songman meant no processing but the PP you are talking about would take forever! I do that for the dance shots that i am doing for me, not what i am shoot en mass. about the only thing i do is hit f3, which does a minor level adjust, sharpen, and closes the pic. or use the batch tool. and this is even taking me months. they would never get their images if i shot raw, converted, hdr'd and all that! besides, you should get it right in camera and not have to do a lot to it. (of course for those wow shots that are special i take time out to do all that.)

You are right I did not mean no PP. We cover 105 events per year and average 4000 images per event. Storage alone precludes our using RAW format. The pace of the events is fast and the pace of knocking out prints is as well. What our customers conseiders a "wow" shot does not require 5 layers, blending and hours of processing time. I don't see that dance recital mom is looking for a $300 print, she wants a pretty picture of her little girl and would probably be happy with the quality that 15% of that would buy.

[WooD]

Your lucky. Last week I had to shoot a salsa dance class. Low ceilings, and lots of fluorescent lights with badly yellowed covers over them.

No way to set up any kind of lighting, due to having to take all the shots during the class. Only thing I could do was shoot RAW, and use my SB600.

Actually had a lot of keepers, and the dance instructor was too happy with the shots. So happy he wants me to shoot their once a month dance party at a dim lit restaurant this coming Saturday night. Still thinking of passing on this one. I can only do so much shooting at 1/200 with a single SB600.

[TimAndrea]

no, not really different here. wow shots do help the portfolio. but how do you have the time to edit like that for 10,000+ pics?

[grsphoto]

Originally Posted by Jacco

That sounds like you're set to get a high contrast range in your images, which your digital camera – if set to shoot JPG or TIFF – will not be able to capture. Highlights will either be blown out, or shadows will be all black without any definition. Or both, of course.

You can tackle that by shooting in RAW format, then in PP create different TIFFs with different exposure settings from a single RAW file: say 3 TIFFs 2 stops apart, or 5 TIFFs 1 stop apart. Then you blend/merge them using HDR technique to create an image with well-balanced contrast.

I must really suck as a photographer... I have never gone to this much trouble to get a decent image. Most of the images I get out my may camera ( when I expose them properly) look better when I tighten up the dynamic range ( pull the blacks & the whites in, in levels)

Glenn

[Jacco]

The proof of the pudding is in the eating: employ both techniques on the same scene and put up the end results side by side on your screen. Then decide if it was worth the trouble.
Besides: HDR PP gets faster and faster as you do it more often. And if you use an Action/Script/Macro on a batch, you can go grab a cup of coffee while your computer does what it's best at.

[Songman45]

Originally Posted by Jacco

The proof of the pudding is in the eating: employ both techniques on the same scene and put up the end results side by side on your screen. Then decide if it was worth the trouble.
Besides: HDR PP gets faster and faster as you do it more often. And if you use an Action/Script/Macro on a batch, you can go grab a cup of coffee while your computer does what it's best at.

Too bad you haven't been at one of our shows. Boy what I wouldn't give.

[Jacco]

It all depends on the circumstances: you seem to be in the high-volume production segment of the market. So you can't afford any more time in PP then what's strictly necessary. 'What's strictly necessary' is dependent on the customer's wishes and expectations.
It's almost photo journalism.
But not everybody is in that market segment, Songman! In fact very few people are. You're a minority. So don't confuse your particular situation with everybody else's. Most people don't have hi-speed high-volume production environments!

[Songman45]

Originally Posted by Jacco

It all depends on the circumstances: you seem to be in the high-volume production segment of the market. So you can't afford any more time in PP then what's strictly necessary. 'What's strictly necessary' is dependent on the customer's wishes and expectations.
It's almost photo journalism.
But not everybody is in that market segment, Songman! In fact very few people are. You're a minority. So don't confuse your particular situation with everybody else's. Most people don't have hi-speed high-volume production environments!

[Begin Thread Hi-Jack]
Exactly the point. Your exhaustive PP recommendation does not seem to me or to others to be appropriate for the OPs particular situation. Dance recital pictures fall into that minority market segment I belong in. Sir, your surmation of workflow being germain to customer expectation and alloted time is correct. But it was you who suggested the undertaking of efforts that would push the profitablity of this endeavor into the ground in the first place.[End Thread Hi-Jack]

My apologies to any offended.

Regards,
Steve

[Jacco]

Originally Posted by Songman45

Your exhaustive PP recommendation does not seem to me [...] to be appropriate for the OPs particular situation. Dance recital pictures fall into that minority market segment I belong in.

Yes, Steve: 'that minority market segment I belong in'. You, not the OP! There is no indication whatsoever the OP is in 'your' hi-speed/high-volume production environment at all.

In fact, the OP's set up statement

I am going to set up home studio today. Wish I had a dedicated studio.

strongly suggests that the OP is distinctly NOT in a hi-speed/high-volume production environment. Which opens up possibilities for dedicated PP...

[TimAndrea]

I think this can be summed up in one statement.
Everyone wants a great picture. If time permits and you can definetely take the time to make every pictures better. So do what you can in the circumstance you are in. I take my time when I can and run through them when i cant. i still think my pictures are good both ways. as should you with your pictures.