Need Tips (focusing)

[obtr32]

OK...I know that this has been talked about many times. I'm a 30D owner and has had enough frustraion regarding Cannon's auto focusing ablity.

This came into play when I was at sporting event with another photo guy that had a diffrent brand camera. We both took a photo of a player doing something very cool.... He got the shot...I didn't.

We both compared notes...we both had the same settings...(well..close enough). The thing is....my shot was as sharp as his....except...my photo was of a very sharp back wall...and his was of the player...not fair. Other than that, it looked the same.

Any suggestions?

Pauly

[gryphonslair99]

Originally Posted by obtr32

OK...I know that this has been talked about many times. I'm a 30D owner and has had enough frustraion regarding Cannon's auto focusing ablity.

This came into play when I was at sporting event with another photo guy that had a diffrent brand camera. We both took a photo of a player doing something very cool.... He got the shot...I didn't.

We both compared notes...we both had the same settings...(well..close enough). The thing is....my shot was as sharp as his....except...my photo was of a very sharp back wall...and his was of the player...not fair. Other than that, it looked the same.

Any suggestions?


Pauly

Posting an example would really help with exif data. Also posting your camera settings including custom functions would help.

I shoot sports with a 40D and a 30D. While the AF is not as fast as the 1D MIII it works well. I always shoot in AI Servo mode with a single focus point. Often the center point, but not always. For B-Ball I tend to shoot strictly in portrait mode and use the upper focus point instead most of the time. My Auto focus is always done independent of the shutter button. I also shoot manual and am not afraid to crank up the ISO. My minimum shutter speed is always 1/250th.....always.

Since I don't want to think about which body is in my hands and since Canon did not add a dedicated focus button to the BG-2N grip the * button is dedicated to continous focusing on both bodies. Also, practice keeping your focus point dead on your subject. A split second stray and the camera is re-focusing, often when you press the shutter button. Also realize, that depending on the glass you are shooting, focusing may be more difficult than you would think. That focus point is not a dead on laser, rather it gives you a good idea of what the focusing area is. If you have a small subject at a long distance the camera may be focusing on something different than you expect. If that focus point is bigger than the subject you are just lucking out at that point if you get an in focus shot.

I always use a grip with 2 fresh batteries as I track the motion almost constantly. This eliminates a lot of the toss away first shots as I have been tracking the action not trying to catch up to it.

One of the most important things for shooting sports however is not equipment related. You need to know not only the sport you are shooting, but the players involved in the competition. Almost every player excells at some aspect of the game and is lacking in others. If you know the game and know the players you can anticipate the action and be prepared for what is coming. This again gives you more keepers.

And finally.... Practice, Practice, Practice. Sports photography is one of the most demanding forms of photography. I am getting ready for the new college season and have been shooting practice sessions just to get back at it before the first event. Good luck.

[Jose]

Autofocus is a problem with most digital Canons I own or owned (10D, 20D, 40D, 5D & IDS MKII). And I have tried all kinds of settings and lens/body combinations. My solution is shoot a lot and hope some images are properly focus; my average is less than 10% in perfect focus.

[obtr32]

I think though, its the AI Servo mode that I'm having problems with...

I shoot a lot of roller derby. It's a small oval track with fast moving people.

The problem is when the AI Servo mode is locked at a skater comming at me and then suddenly turns. The camera seems to go "stupid" and refocuses on the bigest object it can find...in this case...the back wall.

Another problem I have is quick shots. There is sometimes that I can get a facial expression from the skaters...the example is someone sticking out thier tounge....you only got a few seconds to get it...and yet...it picks the back wall as the first focusing point...by the time it comes around and into focus...the moment is gone.

Im wondering if at that moment, is it better to start the focusing process to the floor and then bring the camera up to the subject....

In other words...as I'm brining the camera up to my eye...already have the foucusing button pushed ?

[Pony]

The response you got from gryphonslair99 was right on the money.Choose the custom function on the Shutter/AE lock buttion for your shooting situation.Use the center focus point if you still aren't getting the proper focus.You can use one shot AF and center focus point together when following subjects.You may try zone focusing.Canon camera's are popular w/sports for a reason.Put the advice you received into practice and you'll get your shots.Wish you the best.

[gryphonslair99]

Originally Posted by obtr32

I think though, its the AI Servo mode that I'm having problems with...

I shoot a lot of roller derby. It's a small oval track with fast moving people.

The problem is when the AI Servo mode is locked at a skater comming at me and then suddenly turns. The camera seems to go "stupid" and refocuses on the bigest object it can find...in this case...the back wall.

Another problem I have is quick shots. There is sometimes that I can get a facial expression from the skaters...the example is someone sticking out thier tounge....you only got a few seconds to get it...and yet...it picks the back wall as the first focusing point...by the time it comes around and into focus...the moment is gone.

Im wondering if at that moment, is it better to start the focusing process to the floor and then bring the camera up to the subject....

In other words...as I'm brining the camera up to my eye...already have the foucusing button pushed ?

Quit watching Roller Derby. Watch the Action not the event.

I start every event with freshly charged batteries for a reason. The camera is focusing probably 98% of the time that the event is going on. That camera rarely leaves my face except for stops in the action. I am constantly tracking the action through the camera prepared to get the next shot. If a skater turns and the camera is not focusing on the subject, it is because you the shooter did not follow the subject to keep that focus point on them. You have to continue to follow the subjects movement. The camera only focuses on what you point it at. AI servo is locked on what ever you point the camera at. YOU have to be locked onto the action.

I will tell you what I tell parents who are struggling to take good pictures of their kid playing sports. You can be a spectator or you can be a sports shooter, but you can't be both at the same time. Decide which you want to be and concentrate on that alone. If you concentrate on the action alone, you will be able to get good shots.

[aam1234]

Edit: deleted, already been mentioned twice.

[obtr32]

See I agree and disagree at the same time...

I understand what you mean by watch the action and not the event...and you are right. However, sometimes not always true...

Lets use the example of car racing...you lock onto the action of a car rounding the curve...suddenly, two cars behind slams into the wall...ya...you got to refocus on to the new event/action...

This is were my complaint is at....when I swing the 30D over to the new action...it seems to choose the farthest distance to focus on and works it way back...that seems to take forever.

It just seems that once the camera goes into infinity land...it has trouble making it's way back.

There has been times that I great shots lined up...but miss it because the camera is trying to decide what to lock onto...and it seems to favor my dreaded back wall..

[aam1234]

Which focusing point(s) do you use.

[E-Man]

Gryphon, thanks for sharing your technique! I was just reading somewhere else on the forums where they were championing the separation of the focus and shutter release buttons using the custom settings on the 40D, I'll have to give it a try. Kiddie soccer season will be starting soon and this sound like it will improve my capture and keeper rates.

Pauly, What type of lens are you using (long tele, short tele, prime) ? Using a long tele might make it harder to keep your focus point on the specific person you have targeted... I tend to waver a good deal just trying to track the kids. I have found that Image stabilization doesn't "really" help with exposing moving subjects, but it "sometimes" helps me track them a little more consistently.

I would also like to know if you have manually selected a specific focus point or are you letting the camera choose one (or more) for you? I've never been thrilled with the results of allowing the camera to choose - seems to always want the closest object to the lens for me.

[Max@Home]

Originally Posted by E-Man

I've never been thrilled with the results of allowing the camera to choose - seems to always want the closest object to the lens for me.

'seems' ?? : it is designed that way!

...€0.02...

Kindest regards!

Max@Home

[E-Man]

Originally Posted by Max@Home

'seems' ?? : it is designed that way!

I kinda figured there was some design rationale behind the consistency of my camera-selected-focus-point out-of-focus images! I had used my 40D in this mode for about an hour when I decided that "feature" would be turned off for good. Glad to know its working as designed - although the way things are designed often conflict with how I use them... Guess its a personal issue!

[aam1234]

Since the OP still didn't tell us which focusing point(s) he is using I thought I'd throw a question in the ring

Always wondered, what's the idea behind using the * for focusing. Doesn't it make it a two steps operation instead of one.

Please enlighten some of us.

Cheers

[obtr32]

Sorry...had to work.

Um...I have played around a little with the focusing points. Lately, I have been using a focusing point that would be center...but now that I'm reading this, I'm thing of changing....

Sometimes, out of frustration, I do let the camera decide...but not very often. I've been finding out that the "autos" setting haven't been working for me. When I say "autos" I mean the auto and portrait settings...

With E-man's suggestion of the lens focusing on the nears object first...I'm having the problem of focusing on the farthest first...

For some reason, I can't seem to shoot well in the sports setting. The place that I shoot is very dark...and I find it easier to shoot when I got control over shutter and aperture....

What do you guys think about moving the focusing point down (center)? Would that keep it off the back wall?

Oh...the two that I like to use is a Canon 17-85 f/4-5.6 and a Promaster 100-400 5.6-6.7....

[gryphonslair99]

Originally Posted by aam1234

Since the OP still didn't tell us which focusing point(s) he is using I thought I'd throw a question in the ring

Always wondered, what's the idea behind using the * for focusing. Doesn't it make it a two steps operation instead of one.

Please enlighten some of us.

Cheers

It makes for independent simultanious operations. Here is an example. You want to speed dial into a radio show quiz. First one in gets the prize. Which is faster.

Use one hand only, pick up the phone and then with the same hand extend one finger and dial..... OR

Use two hands. Hold the phone in one hand while listening to the question. Upon hearing the question instantly dial with the free hand.

That is what separate focus does. The focus tracks while you are waiting for the shot AND it continues to track while depressing the shutter button and triggering the shutter. There is no split second lag between the focus response and the shutter trigger response when depressing a single button. When shooting action at a narrow depth of field a split second can be the difference between tack sharp and pretty sharp.

[gryphonslair99]

Originally Posted by obtr32

See I agree and disagree at the same time...

I understand what you mean by watch the action and not the event...and you are right. However, sometimes not always true...

Lets use the example of car racing...you lock onto the action of a car rounding the curve...suddenly, two cars behind slams into the wall...ya...you got to refocus on to the new event/action...

This is were my complaint is at....when I swing the 30D over to the new action...it seems to choose the farthest distance to focus on and works it way back...that seems to take forever.

It just seems that once the camera goes into infinity land...it has trouble making it's way back.

There has been times that I great shots lined up...but miss it because the camera is trying to decide what to lock onto...and it seems to favor my dreaded back wall..

When you swing the camera, you have lost the action. You are now asking the camera to pickup on new action and focus on it. The camera can not respond as fast as the human eye. YOU have to have the focus point locked on the new target before the Auto Focus can detect and focus on the new target. Until then it is searching for focus with ever changing contrasts. You see a wall, the camera sees moving contrasts and tries to adjust.

My only suggestion in a situation like this is shoot with as small of aperture as you can. It will open you depth of field up and allow the camera to focus more quickly. Not how I would like my sports photos, but the only way I know to accomplish the task as stated.