Fill in Flash

[boristhemoggy]

Originally Posted by swampler

Not sure what your option 1 and option 2 are at the moment.

Here are a few examples. The 1st (white jersey) is metered for background plus flash at +2/3 FEC. The 2nd is metered for background at -1 and flash at +2/3 FEC. The 3rd was a flub where the flash didn't go off (batteries didn't recycle in time). The subject is exposed independently of the background when using flash.

So, in a simple sense, if I have a bright day with potentially an exposure of say, 1/500th, to fill in, I can't use auto or ttl? I have to learn how to use fill in manually.
I'm starting to wonder what the auto setting on the flash is for then, if it forces you into an exposure situation you don't want.
I think someone was right when they said learn how to use flash manually. £450 for a flashgun that's supposed to make life easy, maybe my best bet is to sell it and buy a cheap flash head that will do what I want when set manually?

[poloman]

Originally Posted by boristhemoggy

So, in a simple sense, if I have a bright day with potentially an exposure of say, 1/500th, to fill in, I can't use auto or ttl? I have to learn how to use fill in manually.
I'm starting to wonder what the auto setting on the flash is for then, if it forces you into an exposure situation you don't want.
I think someone was right when they said learn how to use flash manually. £450 for a flashgun that's supposed to make life easy, maybe my best bet is to sell it and buy a cheap flash head that will do what I want when set manually?

Believe me...you don't want a cheap flash.
You could have the same problem with the camera. These devices still need an experienced individual to produce the best results.
When outside, I have had tremendous results using TV on my camera body and setting the flash for -1/3 to -1. I usually set the speed at around 1/100 and can tweak the aperture that the camera chooses by adjusting ISO.

[swampler]

Originally Posted by boristhemoggy

So, in a simple sense, if I have a bright day with potentially an exposure of say, 1/500th, to fill in, I can't use auto or ttl? I have to learn how to use fill in manually.
I'm starting to wonder what the auto setting on the flash is for then, if it forces you into an exposure situation you don't want.
I think someone was right when they said learn how to use flash manually. £450 for a flashgun that's supposed to make life easy, maybe my best bet is to sell it and buy a cheap flash head that will do what I want when set manually?

I had the flash on auto, just with flash exposure compensation. No different than adding exposure compensation to auto mode on your camera.

[Steven G Webb]

Someone explain how to achieve high speed sync so he can get a properly exposed background that's calling for 1/500th and he wants a subject in shade lit 1:1

[poloman]

Try this...
Set your camera to manual mode.
Look at the meter while you point the camera at the background without the subject in the picture. Adjust the camera settings until the needle at the bottom of your viewfinder is on the center of the scale or on -1/3. Make sure your flash is set to high speed sync. It should be in ettl mode.
Take the shot with the subject in the frame.
Of course if your speed is 1/250th or less, high speed sync is not necessary.
You can adjust the flash compensation on the flash if necessary.
When you have a bright background and a dark subject the flash isn't fill but rather your most important light source.
If you really want accuracy, get an incident meter and learn how to use it.
Your camera is adjusted to shoot in average situations. When things are a bit unusual, you have to learn how to compensate.

[boristhemoggy]

OK I'm going to wait til daylight tomorrow, and take a picture. I know the theory that you explained poloman, and high speed comes on in the right circumstances songman, yet all I get is dark, underexposed BG and fully flashed subject grrr
I'll post another tomorrow to show.

[poloman]

Originally Posted by boristhemoggy

OK I'm going to wait til daylight tomorrow, and take a picture. I know the theory that you explained poloman, and high speed comes on in the right circumstances songman, yet all I get is dark, underexposed BG and fully flashed subject grrr
I'll post another tomorrow to show.

You can adjust the brightness of the background and of the subject at will.
If your background is very dark to begin with you may need to increase your iso.
Again...be sure the flash is in ettl mode.

If you want to increase the brightness of the background using the method I outlined set the initial exposure with the needle to the right of zero. If you want to decrease the brightness of the subject set the flash compensation to a more negative value.

[Steven G Webb]

There seems to be missing a discussion about the shutter speed's contribution of the background exposure. For what ever the reason the shutter speed of 1/500th came into play. Flash+1/500th=a necessity for high speed sync. and that's where I'm falling off the train (of thought). So, how about supply the rest of the exposure settings. Somehow I'm feeling if you are getting dark backgrounds at 1/500th you probably aren't needing to be above the camera's max sync speed at all.

[poloman]

Originally Posted by Songman45

There seems to be missing a discussion about the shutter speed's contribution of the background exposure. For what ever the reason the shutter speed of 1/500th came into play. Flash+1/500th=a necessity for high speed sync. and that's where I'm falling off the train (of thought). So, how about supply the rest of the exposure settings. Somehow I'm feeling if you are getting dark backgrounds at 1/500th you probably aren't needing to be above the camera's max sync speed at all.

I was puzzling over that but if he uses the method outlined...no problem.

[lorenbc]

Great information here.

I too struggle with fill flash. I don't use flash that often, so every time I do I have to figure it out all over again; there doesn't seem to be any easy way; even auto is not auto. And I suspect the struggle is part of the reason I tend to avoid flash work.

I always use flash on manual (since AV is a disaster), but have to really work hard to get the proper balance between bg and fg. I'll try the Tv method mentioned earlier in the thread one of these days.

Loren