ND or graduated filters

[JDArt]

I have no ND or graduated filters in my collection, and I always thought I should. Can you recommend a brand as well as a place to purchase? Does scouring e-bay make sense for this kind of thing? I hate to spend money on filters, as I assume many do, but I suspect using them can make the difference between a special picture and an ordinary one in certain circumstances.

[ohenry]

For graduated ND filters, I'd recommend using a Cokin holder and HiTech filters. Cokin filters are not color neutral and you won't really get the color you want. HiTech, Lee, Singh all make resin filters that can be used in the Cokin Filter System holder (or you can opt to pay a higher price for their own filter holder). Lee and HiTech are relatively cheaper than Singh-Ray and optically good. I got mine from Filter Connection http://www.2filter.com/prices/htpackages.html. B&H also carry them. Singh-Ray can be seen at http://www.singh-ray.com/grndgrads.html. These filters are the resin square filters. The advantage is that you can slide the filter up and down to match the horizon and achieve the effect you desire. They come in soft and hard, the difference being the deliniation of the change. Hard are good for even horizons, whereas the soft perform better for uneven horizons. They can double as full ND filters when pulled fully down across the lens.

If you just want ND filters, I would think any circular filter would work as any other filter, in choices of the amount of light reduction desired. Cheap glass will give you trouble, so I would look more towards the better known companies and multicoated filters. If you want to go all out, you can consider the Singh-Ray Variable ND http://www.singh-ray.com/varind.html at a smooth $340 fee. I've heard of people using 2 polarizers in a similar manner to the idea of the VND filter, but I have no personal experience with that. I do have the VND and I can attest that it is a VERY effective ND filter that will control the amount of light entering the lens over a 8-10 stop range.

[Rokcet Scientist]

Imo: get it when you need it. Not for the hell of it.
I felt I might need 'm too – 30 years ago – and I got me a complete Cokin set of about 20/25 filters: ND's, gradients, starbursts, other effects, etc. etc.
I've NEVER used them!
'All dressed up and nowhere to go'.

So save your money until you really need them.

[Mr. Pickles]

RS, why not sell the complete Cokin system? Like to me or someone else here?

If one was to need a graduated ND filter, I'd certain;y go the Cokin (Lee, etc.) route too. The filters are square or rectangle, and require a fancy holder, but the advantages of being about to move the filter up and down, or any which way really, is a HUGE plus over a 50/50 split round screw-on filter.

[edawn]

Originally Posted by Mr. Pickles

RS, why not sell the complete Cokin system? Like to me or someone else here?

If one was to need a graduated ND filter, I'd certain;y go the Cokin (Lee, etc.) route too. The filters are square or rectangle, and require a fancy holder, but the advantages of being about to move the filter up and down, or any which way really, is a HUGE plus over a 50/50 split round screw-on filter.

Bingo! That's what I was wondering...is a filter holder contraption really worth it over a spilt circular one? Sounds like it carries enough of an advantage, in your experience at least.

Elaine

[Fish36990]

Also OHenry....

You mentioned using one for the slower shutter speeds to me yesterday and I looked them up....now I have a question for you (go figure)

What does the 8X mean?

That was the main value I noticed but I'm sure there are other values.

Thanks,
Josh

[JohnC]

Some folks rate ND filters by transmission density: .1, .2, .3, etc. Each point is 1/3 of a stop. So a .3ND filter is one stop. A .6 is two stops.

Others use filter factors: ND2 (one stop), ND4 (2 stops), ND8 (3 stops)

There is a chart to help at http://www.photofilter.com/neutral_density.htm

more at http://dpfwiw.com/filters.htm#nd and http://dpfwiw.com/filters.htm#factors

John

[JohnC]

Found another chart
http://shutterbug.com/refreshercours...01/index5.html

that lists both filter factor and density together.

[Fish36990]

Thanks John,
Any recommendations on what a good density is for the average shooter who doesn't want 5 of them....kind of decent for everything but maybe not perferct for anything?

Thanks,
Josh

[scoundrel1728]

4x or 8x filters will work well when you just need a sunglass for your camera to cut the light level down to a manageable level; something in the range of 1.6 to 2.0 ND (40x to 100x filter factor) will work when you want long exposure times for the silky smooth water effect in landscapes. I tend to dislike this effect myself so I don't have those filters.

[Fish36990]

Thanks scoundrel,
If I can find an 8X and an 40X, then I may pick them up. That should work out for me just fine for most things I want to shoot right? I do want the 40X for the soft water pics...I like them and right now they're winning the battle. I must get at least one really good one before I let it go.

Does that mean I'm compulsive?

Josh

[JohnC]

Really depends on what you shoot. I use ND filters to balance fill flash outdoors to get the shutter speed down into a range that will sync with external strobes. For that I usually use my polarizer (being careful to not remove all the reflections). But I also have an ND8 filter sitting here that I hope to use some day soon.

John

[JDArt]

Thanks a lot, Ohenry and everyone else. This turned out to be a very informative and useful thread. So with the cokin holder, it looks as though you still need to buy a different adapter ring for each lens diameter you intend to use?

I was hoping the filter holder would do away with different sized rings.

[Rokcet Scientist]

Originally Posted by Mr. Pickles

RS, why not sell the complete Cokin system? Like to me or someone else here?[...]

30 Year old filters? Naaah!
Then, I'd have to scrape 'm together, prepare an 'ad' (pix and descriptions), actually do the sale, then pack it, ship it and checking whether payment got in . . . .
Sorry Pickles, but I couldn't be bothered. Too much trouble. That's not worth it to me.
And I submit that for 30 year old filters it ain't worth it for you either!
Besides, I COULD still use 'm. So I've decided I'll keep 'm a 'little longer'. Just in case.
And even if I NEVER use 'm, then I'll probably leave 'm to my grandchildren as part of the inheritance... (wow...)
By then they may be able to sell 'm to the photography museum...

[Mr. Pickles]

Originally Posted by JDArt

So with the cokin holder, it looks as though you still need to buy a different adapter ring for each lens diameter you intend to use?

How many different sizes do you have? Not what you want either, but you could use a step up ring. Say you have a 58mm adapter ring for the filter system. To get your 55mm lens to work, you could just buy a 55-58mm step up ring and screw the 58 to that. I do that with some round filters, as long as I'd have no vignetting.

[Rokcet Scientist]

Originally Posted by Mr. Pickles

How many different sizes do you have? Not what you want either, but you could use a step up ring. Say you have a 58mm adapter ring for the filter system. To get your 55mm lens to work, you could just buy a 55-58mm step up ring and screw the 58 to that. I do that with some round filters, as long as I'd have no vignetting.

I agree with Pickles, JD.
I don't think it's a big problem anyway: if I recall correctly, I have 2 rings, a 58mm and a 62mm (or was it 64...?). No step-up rings. Between them these 2 rings fit all the old lenses (4) – ranging from 24mm to 300mm – on my Minolta 9Xi film camera. And they're not very expensive.

So look at your lenses, note their filter sizes, and look up what filters and ring(s) you might want at http://www.cokin.com/. Cokin has adaptor rings from 25mm up to 118mm!

[badpickev]

Originally Posted by JDArt

Thanks a lot, Ohenry and everyone else. This turned out to be a very informative and useful thread. So with the cokin holder, it looks as though you still need to buy a different adapter ring for each lens diameter you intend to use?

I was hoping the filter holder would do away with different sized rings.

cokin has 2 different holders as well. if you have a lot of long lenses you will learn to hate yourself for it. the graduated filers are really cool. i see with nikon most of the glass uses common filter sizes so getting a nd 2 and 4 in the common sizes will work for most. i use graduated for large sky shots