How does a portrait photographer make a living?

[waple]

You both make excellent points. If I were really experienced and had made a name for myself, I would definitely like Heartseye's idea, and that's what I'd like to eventually accomplish. However, it may make sense for someone starting out to begin with Songman's suggestions, and when I can, transition myself more toward Heartseye's.

There is a lot that I, and others like me, can take from both perspectives.

[Julio]

Songman45
your comments rocks
very good

[Light Currents]

Originally Posted by heartseye

I mean you no insult at all, Songman. But what you suggest to Waple will guarantee mediocrity

I think both heartseye and songman make good points. However, I feel that "medocrity" was a poorly-chosen word. The definition of it is: "of only ordinary or moderate quality; neither good nor bad; barely adequate; rather poor or inferior."

Rather I think what Songman is describing is a good formula for long-term, sustained steady work and income with an emphasis placed on stability. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that goal - if that is what your goal is.

On the other hand, Heartseye speaks of growth and expansion. There's nothing wrong with that goal either.

Each path inherently has both positive and negative aspects, you know what they are: one path is stable with steady work and income, but may never achieve reputational greatness, the other path may achieve reputational greatness, but may also result in sitting around staring at walls without steady work or income.

To agree on one point, the most important point of all: it's a personal choice. But whatever path you choose it is important you spend quality time formulating your plans and writing them down. If you want to be a professional photographer, then see it for what it is - a business. And the first steps any professional will give you about either starting up a business or expanding an existing one is to create a good business plan then follow it.

As to the OP's original question, a good approach is to study the methodology and successes of others. It might be a successful franchise, or a successful photog catering to upscale clientele - or a mixture of both. Be bold - call or visit photographers in the area, tell them of your plans and ask questions about how they did it. I learned a long time ago that you would be surprised how willing people are to talk about their businesses and successes - even those classified as competitors. Besides, there's side benefits: you'll be making contacts, you might make a friend, you'll be establishing a network and there is no telling about the work you may get from one of those photogs in the future when they have an overage.

[eastley]

It would be rather hard to work out asking prices, I myself as a starter would be free, however I have no studio or anything, so why bother, lol.

I would defiently never take family pics for a loss, photography expensive as it is.

[TonyK]

Oh heck, its not like I don't have enough stress in my life. :|

Songman offered concrete suggestions and a means to accomplish them. Heartseye eluded to something bolder BUT never provided any details, even when requested.

Guess who's advice I would follow? Its not hard.

Also looking at the little statistics in each person's profile, Heartseye has posted more than Songman but Songman has more karma, both actual and statistical. That means people like what they get from Songman more, meaning he is trying to be upfront and forthright in his dealings. Not eluding to something fantastic but dealing with the day in and day out details.

Its one thing to say "do the bold" but being "bold" means different things to each of us.

Heartseye, if you have details on "being bold" please provide them. One and all are interested, at least Songman and I are, and it would provide us a stronger basis for further discussion.

Songman, karma to you for providing concrete details on how to put in place a game plan. It is what a lot of us would need to get started.

Take care,

[Songman45]

Tony,

The karma is appreciated Thank you for taking time to post it and the comment.

I joined the Camel because I am seeking answers. I have been fortunate to have met others here who have already walked the path I'm on and they have given me pointers for my journey. I have also come across some folks who are behind me and pressing forward. Its good to help while getting help. I don't know a lot about many things but anything I do know, I'll freely share.

Thanks again. I am most appreciative.

[HuBBaTheMan]

In my life plan... doing the "mediocre" things that bring in the bread is what allows me to do the "bold" things that may elevate me to a higher and potentially more lucrative client base.

The trick is in the balance so you have time (and money) for both.

[TonyK]

And here is a piece to build on from Songman. Do what needs doing and on your own time build the skills and knowledge to be bolder.

Thank you for providing information on how you approach your photographic career.

Originally Posted by HuBBaTheMan

In my life plan... doing the "mediocre" things that bring in the bread is what allows me to do the "bold" things that may elevate me to a higher and potentially more lucrative client base.

The trick is in the balance so you have time (and money) for both.

[Pony]

At this point you need broader information than what this thread can give you.I recommend reading "The Business of Studio Photography," by Edward R. Lilley.This book can help you decide if you really want to pursue your course by letting you know what your pursuit involves.It covers pricing,business plans,marketing, various forms of the portrait market ,and more.It is pertinent reading for those who are beginning as well as those already established.

[jefferies]

In my area many "Boutique Studio"( small upper end locations focused on upper end clients) portrait photographers charge a moderate sitting fee...maybe $100.00 to get the client into the studio and weed out those without any money. They take all kinds of shots aimed at layout of a book or album to be sold at a good profit margin later. They adjust around 40-50 images and bring the client back to view the finished work. The look is usually more unique and the studio is known for that look. Usually 8x10 are in the $200.00 range, large 20x24 in the $600.00 range etc. A nice layout in a book style album could be $400.00 to $1200.00 depending on the album. Of course this is done in a professional looking studio enviroment, not a garage. A retail place or even converted house works and allows you to charge more for your services. I know some list a minimum purchase in addition to the up front sitting fee.From what I see they end up with sales in the $800.00-$2000.00 all the time...and sometimes a lot more.
On the other side you have the volume shooters. They get you in with a $10.00 special and then charge for every thing you can think of. A inkjet print would be $25.00 then a Archival print would be $50.00 plus a coating to protect it $15.00 etc. I am not a salesperson so my selling skills do not fit this enviroment but it seems to work well for many in the business. Some located in the local malls doing this seem to do very well. I have seen receips for over $1000.00 and a handful of what I consider production photos. Bottom line is both types of studios are charging for the Artistic insite and abality to capture the image the client wants to see and keep. They are not charging for copies like Costco or Wallgreens. Of course the hard part is getting the right client into your studio. That is where you make money or waste all of it on advertisement.

[loraksus]

Originally Posted by Songman45

There is not difference in a $10 whore a $200 prostitute or a $1000 call girl.

Except for the itching and peeing blood part of course.

[d2creative]

Originally Posted by heartseye

Look, Waple knows what Waple needs to do. He's just looking for an easier path, and you have offered him one. Nothing at all wrong with that.....but He NEEDS to decide where he wants to be on the ladder. When he does that, and makes a commitment to his dreams, then I'll happily re-visit this kind of discussion.

If you have something to say, say it.
Enquiring minds want to know.

[brian.austin]

Originally Posted by d2creative

If you have something to say, say it.
Enquiring minds want to know.

Don't hold your breath on that one, for three reasons:

1. Those posts were made last May.
2. Giving away secrets of success is just bad business. I give general direction but why would I tell you my formula for Magic Love Potion #9 if it's making me money?
3. The words "Former Camel" under Bob's (heartseye) name indicate he was forcefully encouraged to find recreation elsewhere due to ticking off PC management. In other words, he might be lurking but he's not posting, at least as Heartseye.

[d2creative]

Yeah, i noticed after I posted it was an older thread.
Poop. I was sincerely interested in the answer! Oh well.

[coalcliff]

"There is not difference in a $10 whore a $200 prostitute or a $1000 call girl."

You are so right there Songman. just ask Hugh Grant and Elliot Spitzer .... the upfront cost is the least of the bills.....hmmm just like the cost of a portrait sitting really.

[brian.austin]

Originally Posted by coalcliff

"There is not difference in a $10 whore a $200 prostitute or a $1000 call girl."

You are so right there Songman. just ask Hugh Grant and Elliot Spitzer .... the upfront cost is the least of the bills.....hmmm just like the cost of a portrait sitting really.

Let's see....

Hugh Grant was caught in a car with a cheap, rather unattractive, hooker while dating Elizabeth Hurley. Hurley subsequently dumped him and he went on to make millions acting in movies.

Elliot Spitzer was spending thousands on gorgeous women for a full night's activities. His political career is over...for now...and I'm sure his marriage isn't doing so well. If what they're saying is true, he might be up for fraud or embezzlement charges later.

From your comparison, I can take a $10 whore in a dark car (thank goodness), get caught, and move on to success OR take a $1000 call girl in a hotel room, get caught through accounting records, and lose my job. There's a difference there.

The bigger difference would be the quality of the women, the acts, and their enthusiasm. Remember, in the end, you get what you pay for.

[coalcliff]

Well Brian I am sure that if this was posted in the KMC section we could get down to the nitty gritty

What I was saying is that both men spent an up front amount of dosh for the service and in reality it cost them many many times over that cost to move on from there...

Hugh Grant did not have a fan club paying his pr people to get his image back up to an acceptable level his target market would accept, if you think his people all stood round the work kettle and said no worries it will blow over (no pun) then i can sell you Manhattan.

So just like a portrait sitting..affordable at the time but then the real cost raises its head. Once again no pun intended...really!

Blame Songman for the analogy that started this LOL