Pricing a Wedding Album

[kgphoto]

Kelly,

You are going to kick yourself when you do it. It will take so little time and so easy, you will say why didn't I do this right when Kirk told me to.

You will kick yourself a second time when, on a job, you go this is so much easier and faster with calibrated equipment.

You might even be want to send me money!

[KellyL]

Okay...just send me your address. Better yet, I'll come and visit you in your studio.

[Not4wood]

OK, guys

I've calibrated my Monitor. I can see calibrating the camera with a white wall but how do you calibrate the Light Meter? Are you talking about an external meter or the built in one for the camera My very old Meter (which I need a new battery and for some reason the battery is hard to get) doesn't have a method to do anything with for calibration. Is it on the Cameras side?? Or am I looking to get a new Light Meter as well thats what I need, to spend more money when I'm now saving up for a nice Zoom 300 VR 2.8 lens....

[kgphoto]

Do a Google search for Lee Varis and an article he wrote in the March/April 2007 Digital Photo Pro Magazine, his book Skin or a link somewhere on this site and you will see what you need to do in detail.

I will make one point here, that I think if you are going to be a professional photographer and charge and earn money for your work, you should have and know how to use a hand held light meter that meters both ambient and flash light. You may only use it to standardize your approach, but it will lay the foundation for the rest of your work with the greatest speed and accuracy. I use it all the time rather than the one on the camera, as auto settings are good 80 % of the time and I can 't live with 20% Failure.

It is all about knowing how your system will record a scene and being able to get consistent repeatable results.

[Mark McCall]

Originally Posted by Not4wood

Nice selling point with the one dollar = 1 point, and 1 16x20 for an extra $500 dollars worth of other prints sold is a very big plus. I like this idea, how does it work in practice?? Sometimes something on paper doesn't necesarrily work when you try and put it into play?

It's tripled our post wedding print sales.
It's based loosely on the old S&H Greenstamps that used to be given out as a customer loyalty awards by grocery stores.
We've used it with outstanding success for 7 or 8 years.

Originally Posted by Not4wood

Now, see nobody had mentioned these 4 up contact sheets till now. Listed with shot numbers to choose from. These are still Proofs and the Bride is taking them home so she can choose which prints they want in there Album. So now we have the proofs made into a different form with 4 shots to a page. But there still proofs, and the Bride is still choosing her shots...................... enough said

Apparently you didn't read my earlier posts closely enough.

The contact sheet isn't a proof book.
It's delivered with the album long after the bride has previewed her book online, and given us approval to proceed with print and bind. It's used solely as a way to associate images with numbers to assist with post wedding print orders.

When you shrink an 11x14 album pages to 4 up on an 8.5 x 11 sheet, the images get VERY small.
Quality isn't great when printed on card stock, but you don't want it to be. It's only used to associate images with numbers.

No, she doesn't pick out what goes in the book. We do that.

[waves]

Mark,
Do you provide any online gallery and if so is this done before or after you have design the album and have gotten their approval, also as far as pricing is concern does your price include the album or do you have one of those album credits like alot of photographers are doing now days. Correct me if I am wrong but I thought I read that you wrote somewhere that your package price includes the album? Can you explain a little more on this? Thanks!!

[waves]

bump

[chaz345]

Originally Posted by kgphoto

that would be great if we could predict what the profit will be or should be from each and every wedding. I remember back when I started and I got my firsts $1000 sale. I thought it would never get better. Then I made an $1800 sale, then $2500 and so on. I thought I had topped out at $3200, when I got my $5000 sale.

The fact is, there is a broad market out there and you have to find the market you want to work it and then find out what THEY WANT and then DELIVER! This means selling yourself to them and filling the image in their mind with someone they want to business with and that they are comfortable paying whatever you charge to get the products and services for their special day.

Not everyone will be YOUR client.

It doesn't matter what a given client might pay, what matters is how much you want to make. If you set up your pricing structure such that you make an amount that makes you happy, then any additional amount that the client may have paid is irrelevant. But looking at the other side, if you set up your pricing such that you count on additional sales in order to reach the level that makes you happy, and those additional sales get lost to people scanning and making their own prints, which will happen eventually, then you have suffered a real loss. The money that a client may have paid but didn't isn't a loss if your base price is enough that you are happy with what you are making.

I'm not saying that pricing this way is the only way to go. I was just saying that many photographers have gone to pricing that way to avoid the hassles of customers copying things and canabalizing their post sales. True they might be limiting their upside sales potential somewhat, but like I said before, if you've already made an amount that make you happy for hte amount of work you put in, does that really matter?

[Mark McCall]

Originally Posted by waves

Mark,
Do you provide any online gallery and if so is this done before or after you have design the album and have gotten their approval.

We do not provide an online gallery of the images themselves.
We only post an online flash based flip book, and an accompanying PDF to allow closer view of the images on the page.
The bride gets a contact sheet with the album containing image numbers.

..BUT.... let me qualify that.
Just recently we had two inquiries about putting up online galleries to assist in ordering post wedding prints. Both families had valid points. Families from out of town would like to order, but do not have access to the image numbers.
We've only had this request twice (both recently), after being in business for 11 years, so I'm not quite ready to start offering it, but we are investigating it. There are upsides and downsides to doing it.
Historically & monetarily speaking, online proofing has never been a good vehicle for proofing.

Originally Posted by waves

does your price include the album or do you have one of those album credits like alot of photographers are doing now days. Correct me if I am wrong but I thought I read that you wrote somewhere that your package price includes the album?

The price is turn key. Includes my time shooting the wedding, album design, and the album itself. Easy.

Here's my 7 hour coverage:
The Royal Collection $4099
7 hours on-site wedding day coverage, Engagment session, bridal session, a 14x14 Renaissance Album, matted style.
(engagment and bridal are session only, no prints and are in-studio only. Each can be upgraded to a location portrait for $99).
No preview with this album.

Add $500 for our Platinum Upgrade, which includes all of the above and a collage style Bon Match wedding album, which includes online preview.

The word "Upgrade" is a powerful word.
It's terminology the bride understands. She hears it every day.

When she bought her new car after graduation, the leather interior was an upgrade.
I stayed at the UALR Hilton this past weekend, where they upgraded my room to an interior room with a better view for $$. I bit...even though I knew what they were doing to me.
It's a way to squeeze a few extra bucks from a session, wedding or service.

[kgphoto]

Originally Posted by chaz345

It doesn't matter what a given client might pay, what matters is how much you want to make.

If you set up your pricing structure such that you make an amount that makes you happy, then any additional amount that the client may have paid is irrelevant.

. . . if you've already made an amount that make you happy for hte amount of work you put in, does that really matter?

To continue the discussion of these three points:

It DOES matter what a given client might pay, because you are more efficient marketing to those clients who might pay more. If they're poor, show them the door!

How "happy" do you want to be? How happy could you be? Would you like to be happy just for now or in the future as well. Most don't know what the market will bear and undercharge due to lack of confidence and market knowledge and leave a lot of money on the table that the customer would willingly supply and be happy to do so.

If you made "enough" money, then not as much, but if you didn't (for whatever reason) then yes, it matters greatly. It ALSO affects more than YOU. It affects your market and other photographers. Look at the impact local sales have in the housing market.

[chaz345]

Originally Posted by kgphoto

To continue the discussion of these three points:

It DOES matter what a given client might pay, because you are more efficient marketing to those clients who might pay more. If they're poor, show them the door!

How "happy" do you want to be? How happy could you be? Would you like to be happy just for now or in the future as well. Most don't know what the market will bear and undercharge due to lack of confidence and market knowledge and leave a lot of money on the table that the customer would willingly supply and be happy to do so.

If you made "enough" money, then not as much, but if you didn't (for whatever reason) then yes, it matters greatly. It ALSO affects more than YOU. It affects your market and other photographers. Look at the impact local sales have in the housing market.

Money that you didn't charge the customer that they may have been willing to spend is not a loss. Money that they didn't spend because they scanned proofs or downloaded online images and made their own prints is. If your pricing is such that you are satisfied with your income versus time spent, and have the $$ to invest for the retirement and to maintain and purchase equipment, then the money that the clients might have spent but didn't is completely irrelevant. And if you really look as the actual total $$ exchanged under the two different pricing models, if you are comparing apples to apples in terms of photog experience and in terms of the market segment they target, I'd bet a bunch that the numbers are very close to eachother.

[kgphoto]

Originally Posted by chaz345

Money that you didn't charge the customer that they may have been willing to spend is not a loss.

Money that they didn't spend because they scanned proofs or downloaded online images and made their own prints is.

if you are comparing apples to apples in terms of photog experience and in terms of the market segment they target, I'd bet a bunch that the numbers are very close to eachother.

Money not earned via time spent is a loss. Why not spend time with the clients that have an interest, desire and ability to spend the way you want?

Not sure of the point you are trying to make with the second comment above. Perhaps you could clarify?

I have compared apples to apples in my own business. One brother got the proofs the next didn't. Both hired me. The second brother bought more, even though it was the second wedding in the family. By stopping including proofs, MY orders doubled.